Gil Doesn’t Get It
Stop blogging and start studying
Don’t get me wrong, I dig Gilbert Arenas. Gil happens to be one of my main dudes in the league. And, yes, I dig his blog. I dig his rookie-season stories about getting toasted by Gary Payton, his insane admissions about going on “strike” with wifey and sleeping at a gym for seven days, his candor on contract negotiations — I dig all that. I even dug his childish, attention-whoring post that called for fans to vote him into an All-Star Game that he can’t physically play in. Some folks call Gill quirky; I call Gil giddy. There’s something schoolboyish about him. Schoolboys, however, are sophomoric. That’s cool when you’re writing a trailblazing blog — that’s where schoolboy antics would motivate a pro athlete to divulge bizarre stories about pube-shaving mishaps. That stuff is funny. It’s not funny when an NBA point guard writes a small-minded, schoolboy blog post about the “Perception of a Point Guard” and utters words and thoughts so brick-headed and ignorant that you struggle to understand whether he’s that dense or if there is something conniving going on.
A few days ago, Gil wrote this mumble-jumble about point guards, making it clear that he failed to take advantage of his observatory time on the bench in plain clothes. Instead of studying Andre Iguodala’s contract negotiations, Gil should’ve been studying Chauncey Billups. Then, not only would he have had a less toddler-like understanding of what makes a “pure point guard”, but he’d also have been studying this generation’s greatest example of how a small guard with a scorer’s mentality adjusted his game and mastered the one, all-important point-guard duty: running an offense.
Gil’s assertion, based on what he wrote, was that, in order to be a “pure point guard”, you had to pass much more than you shoot. “I was like, ‘Who are the point guards in the league today? How many are there if there are any?’ We came up with the superstars. There was Jason Kidd at No. 1 … and from there, you could argue. Who’s a “pass-first” point? Who’s a “pure” point? Steve Nash? I don’t know.”
SLAM Fam: can you believe that Gilbert Arenas — one of the highest profile athletes in the NBA, a seven-year vet, a future Max Contract Guy, with basketball as his trade — questioned whether Steve Nash is a “pure” point guard?! That’s like Greg Oden wondering whether Shaq is a pure center.
Then he hits us with this doozy: “Who were the point guards back in the day? Muggsy Bogues, Stockton, Terrell Brandon…” So, Magic Johnson, Isiah Thomas, Mo Cheeks, Tim Hardaway, Kevin Johnson, Mark Price — these dudes weren’t point guards, I’m guessing they must have been something else.
It gets worse. Throughout the blog, he hits us with these torrents of illogic thought, rube-talk, such as: “You would say Chris Paul … but what if he didn’t have the assists, would he still be pure points? Like Steve Nash, he’s averaging 17 points and 11 assists, something like that. So, is that a pure point guard? He’s averaging more points than assists.” So, Gil actually ponders whether Chris Paul and Steve Nash — the two best points in the league — are truly point guards, right? But then he offers this headscratcher a few paragraphs later: “I consider Tony Parker a pure point guard because he only scores in transition. In half court, he really doesn’t.” So, because Parker doesn’t score in half-court settings (even though he does — a lot), he’s a point guard in Gil’s Bizarro World — even though Parker, moreso than any other supposed top-flight point guards, barely runs the Spurs offense.
Folks, you’ve got to understand why this shallow garble about point guards is so alarming … the fact is: the sole reason why the Wizards may never be a contender is not just because Gil hasn’t studied enough Billups, but he either seems to have no real grasp of what it means to be a point guard or he’s purposely diminishing the definition of a point guard to make his play look less inadequate.
Was there ever a time when KJ or Tim Hardaway were called combo guards? Yet, they had prolific scoring years. They were, in fact, quite unstoppable during their heydays — precursors and paradigms for Gilbert Arenas. But guess what else? These dudes would put up 25 and dish out 12, in the same game. They also knew how to involve teammates, get their points within the framework of an offense, control tempo and lead the squad on court. True, NBA offenses were less about isolation-plays in the 80s and early 90s, and Magic’s influence had yet to embolden a generation of big men to create their own shots; but that first batch of modern NBA point guards obviously understood when to shoot, when to pass, when to press action, when to motivate, when to involve a sleeping teammate, how to feed a hot hand, etc. Zeke could have averaged 30 ppg in his prime — years in which Detroit won two trophies and challenged for about four others — instead he did between 18-20 ppg and 8-10 apg. There were also years, like 1987, when Magic’s Lakers won the whole-thang with Magic dropping close to 24 ppg. He also averaged more than 12 apg that season and shot a discerning 53% from the field.
Today, however, we’re in The Platinum Age and you can carry it one of two ways: either you’re dope enough to pull a Chris Paul/Deron Williams and put up a good amount of points and dish it out like crazy; or you pull a Chauncey Billups and reign in your game, working within the structure of your offense. Gil may say, “I do work within my offense,” but that’s not necessarily the point. Since Gil has been with Washington — as a playoff squad — he’s taken about 20 shots per game, making a low percentage and sporting an assist-to-turnover ration well below 2-to-1. That means that Gil takes about one-fourth of his squad’s shot, misses more than he makes and — as the Wiz’ point guard — turns the ball over twice for every three assists. Honestly, that is why the Wizards are stuck in neutral as a middle-rung circus show that gets bounced by less talented teams.
Real talk: there’s no real reason for a point guard to shoot 20 times per game or average 28 ppg — straight up. Imagine if a couple of those shots turned into a few passes to Brendan Haywood — in a position to score. What if the other two went to Young Andre Blatche? The answer is not to move Gil off-the-ball. That’s the Iverson Copout. That also takes unnecessary ingenuity to find a way to make up for the inevitable defensive deficiencies inherit to small backcourts and takes the ball out of the hands of your team’s most talented player. In an ideal world, Gilbert Arenas should have a high enough Bball IQ to make the right decisions with the basketball in his hands; the squad shouldn’t need to parcel that responsibility to Plain Jane dudes like Eric Snow and Antonio Daniels, just so the little dudes can strictly focus on putting up shots.
Gil’s blog was so extremely and deeply dumb, that I can’t take it at face-value. I know Gil is a weird dude, with brain that operates in some alternate realm. But even he can’t delude himself into thinking that there’s even a sliver of doubt when it comes to Nash and Paul’s point guard credentials. He’s not that clueless. All his gum-bumping seemed to be apart of an elaborate scheme to put the best point guards into a common box with himself. “Steve Nash, Chris Paul, Deron Williams,” he seemed to be saying, “aren’t really point guards, they’re players, just like me.” His argument seemed to foster the idea that the “point guard” label is fit only for those of moderate talent and capabilities, he named Jacque Vaughn specifically. He did this because he knows that he’s lacking, that he simply doesn’t measure up to the best dudes that man his position and his refusal or inability to perform the duties of the position on an elite level is a personal indictment.
I was hoping that Gil would have seen how the Wiz have played in his absence and returned to the court willing and committed to putting some of his game on mute. It is, afterall, in the best interest of his squad. A less offensive-minded Gil would mean a more dangerous Washington Wizards. Chauncey Billups knows this about the Pistons. Lil’ Chris knows he could put up five or six more shots per game and average 26 or 27 ppg, instead he’s made Tyson Chandler a viable option. Kyle Korver is more dangerous with Deron than he was with AI. Even stepping away from the point guard position and looking at Kobe’s evolution, it’s quite easy to see that Sasha Vujacic, Jordan Farmar and ‘Drew Bynum are better players because of Kobe’s increased unselfishness. I thought Gil was coming to terms with this watching the games in a suit. Then he wrote that blog, one that literally drained me of energy while reading it.
No, Gil, the ability to score doesn’t preclude performing well as a point guard. Yes, Steve Nash is a pure point guard, as is Chris Paul and Deron Williams; as were KJ and Hardaway and Zeke and Magic and Tiny. I love Gil’s game-winners and dominating scoring spurts; but I want to see the Wiz morph into contenders. But, until he learns how to do his Chauncey Thang or Deron Thang, it’s not gonna happen. When is he going to come to terms with this?
Vincent Thomas is a SLAMOnline columnist and SLAM Magazine contributor. He can be reached at vincethomas79@gmail.com.
84 Responses to “Gil Doesn’t Get It”
Mar.12 at 3:08 pm
Eboy says:
Vince continues to put it down, with the realness. Damn, man, good sh*t. Poor Gil, never saw it coming.
Mar.12 at 3:18 pm
TADOne says:
This is why I would offer Caron a max contract before Gil. Great read Vince.
Mar.12 at 3:19 pm
BETCATS says:
2. Vincent!! You are the man. At least somebody gets it!!!
Mar.12 at 3:23 pm
Slick Nick Da Ruler says:
Very nice Vince, if only you could actually slap NBA players. Gil needs his slap, and he needs to realize he’s not even a max contract player.
Mar.12 at 3:24 pm
Ryan Jones says:
All this focus on substance is really missing the point.
Mar.12 at 3:25 pm
Kevin says:
agree with you completely, i just read his blog and felt bored all of a sudden - i knew he was immature before, but the entertainment value was enough to keep me interested.. this last post of his is just absurd though.
Mar.12 at 3:34 pm
RM # 0 says:
Hey Vincent, I think you misunderstood Gilbert.
His main point is that we should stop putting labels on players who’re good and just call them players.
Mar.12 at 3:37 pm
theway01 says:
Your retort on Gilbert Arenas’ blog was as long his blog was! I’m going to have to side with Mr. Arenas. Even though he’s rambling, he rambling about something he does for a living and has knowledge about. You sir, merely write about it; quite verbosely I might add.
Mar.12 at 3:45 pm
SteveC says:
Gilbert wasn’t making a structured argument. It’s obvious he was just jotting down random notes without any real thesis. Your criticism is completely out of place.
Mar.12 at 3:52 pm
FLUXLAND says:
Good call Vince! He’s just masking his inability or the importance of “running an offense” by saying: “PG/SG ..whatever.. we are all just bball players.. so what I cannot run an offense… i put fans in the seats and make special edition shoes…now pay me, sucker!”
Mar.12 at 3:55 pm
what says:
Gilbert did a horrendous job making his point and it’s clear he needs to take writing classes, but I think his point is that categorizing him as a “combo guard” just because his strongest suit is scoring is unfair to him because it implies he can’t pass. I don’t think that’s a terrible argument.. may not apply to him but it does apply to some other NBA players, like Baron Davis for example.
Mar.12 at 3:58 pm
dkosei2 says:
Hot garbage. His whole point was stop trying to label players and put them in a box and let them play. There’s no such thing as a pure point guard anyway. I remember when steve nash dropped 50 in the playoffs on the mavs. Was he a pure point guard when he did that?
Mar.12 at 3:58 pm
Raynmann says:
I started reading his blog the other day, man, had to stop, ‘cause I’m allergic to stupidity!!
Mar.12 at 4:08 pm
Tommy Patron says:
The player’s job is to play. The problem is coaches and organizations. Coaches and teams have the power and should have the ability to devise a system to best utilize the talents of their players and put said players into their system and require them to execute the way the coach and team want. That part of the NBA is pretty much broken, and it will be a long time, if ever, that it is rectified.
Mar.12 at 4:11 pm
TADOne says:
Larry Brown would make Gil cry.
Mar.12 at 4:13 pm
Allenp says:
Gil’s whole point was “Love me and pay me.” That’s it. I liked the article, although I thought you were a little harsh on AI. But, I can’t say that you are totally wrong about him either.
Mar.12 at 4:28 pm
Cub Buenning says:
So Darren Colinson, DJ Augustin, and Mike Green aren’t point guards, either….Gil must watch a lot of Missouri Valley ball and fell in love with conference POY, Emmenecker; the dude that averaged 8 p/g. Gil’s takes are stupid.
A great read,though, Vince
Mar.12 at 5:03 pm
Big Vanilla Earthquake says:
I think Gil was trying to explain why people shouldn’t hate on his game by saying he is not a pure point. One of the whole points of his blog was to determine the real definition of a pure point.
Mar.12 at 5:08 pm
Steve says:
Nice article, although I do have one issue with it - this bit: “So, Magic Johnson, Isiah Thomas, Mo Cheeks, Tim Hardaway, Kevin Johnson, Mark Price — these dudes weren’t point guards” - just because he doesn’t mention these people who find fault? Well you didn’t mention Cousy or Lenny Wilkens…So should I find fault with you?
Mar.12 at 5:08 pm
Steve says:
*you find fault
Mar.12 at 5:17 pm
stevie says:
Gilbert definitely doesnt get it. he should be playing 2guard, and the Wizards should be looking for a big 6-5 Pointguard to share the backcourt with him. Andray Blatche is the future by the way. I like Nick Young too. Caron Butler is the best player on that team. Absolute stud of a young leader and star player for the Wiz.
Mar.12 at 5:21 pm
Tariq says:
Nice column, Vince. P.S.
There is something inherently comic about the very name “Gilbert”
Mar.12 at 5:22 pm
stevie says:
I would never run for Gil. He is selfish, and has no clue. If I was a teammate of his, why should I run for him up the court? Just to watch him jack up a 3 so I have to run back on defense? No thank you, I’ll stay right here and wait for you guys to come back to this end in a couple seconds…..
Mar.12 at 5:29 pm
Bill says:
THIS IS THE EXACT REASON THAT THE WIZ WENT 2-5 WITH GIL TO START THE YEAR AND THEN WENT 24-13 WITHOUT HIM WHILE CARON LED THE WAY WITH UNSELFISH OFFENSE (HIGHLY EFFICIENT, GREAt OFFENSE As THE 1st OPTION), aND INSTILLED A HARDWORKING/TOUGHNEss ATTITUDe WHile THEY FOLLOWED HIS DEFENSIVE EFFORT IN BECOMING A 10TH RANKED DEFENSIVE TEAM (AFTER BEING NEARLY LAST WITH GIL FOR 3 STRAIT YEARS). Caron Butler is more of a PG than Gilbert is. Caron Butler is a MUCH BETTER allaround player and leader than Gilbert is. Gilbert will never figure it out. PERIOD.
Mar.12 at 6:07 pm
Jake Appleman says:
You guys know that Gil doesn’t actually write his own blog, right? He has a phone conversation with a reporter from NBA.com, and then the convo gets put into blog form. I just thought that was worth mentioning. It seems like taking anything Gil “writes” too seriously is problematic as well.
Mar.12 at 6:40 pm
DP says:
That was f*cking amazing Vince. You just keep it like it is and you never hold back. You will go very far my brother. But getting back on Gil, what the hell is wrong with this guy. Did someone fry his brain? To say that TONY EVA LONGARIA is a true point guard is like saying Burger King is better than McDonald’s. They are just stupid ass comments. This guy has got a little too much swag for me now. He needs to keep the splash down to minium of 20 percent. and I thought I was feelin myself………………….
Mar.12 at 6:48 pm
ciolkstar says:
Word Apple. Everybody calm down. Getting this worked up over the precise definition of “pure point guard” or Gilbert’s slight misconceptions of it just isn’t worth it.
Mar.12 at 6:49 pm
ciolkstar says:
He is wrong about TP though… he takes a lot of shots in the halfcourt.
Mar.12 at 7:22 pm
Adam says:
The fact is that the wizards would be a better team if Gil did the right thing, run an offense and get other people involved. And yes Nash scored 50 in the playoffs (actually i think it was 48) but the fact is he makes the RIGHT play, it doesn’t seem like the TRUE points worry about stats, they worry about WINS. I dont think Nash went out and said im score 50 today. He got a win whatever way he could. Gilbert is selfish and will openly tell you he is going you score 50, with no regard for his teammates. Look at Kobe. Everybody knows that he is the most talented player in the league but he could never do it by himself. Thats why he is winning now, he has put his ego aside, trusted his teammates, and has everybody worried to meet the Lakers in the playoffs. Yes Gil plays and Vince does not, but an idiot is an idiot plan and simple.
Mar.12 at 7:23 pm
Russ Bengtson says:
I don’t think anyone in their right mind–or Gilbert, for that matter–thinks that a “true point guard” is one that averages more assists than points. Also see: Jones, Ryan.
Mar.12 at 7:23 pm
Adam says:
*plain
Mar.12 at 7:40 pm
Marcus Toney-El says:
I think he just wrote that for dudes like this Vincent cat to get all fired up. Why are you worried about everything Gilbert Arenas says? After a certain age (10, maybe??) you shouldn’t hang on every word another man says. Hobby…….get one.
Mar.12 at 8:21 pm
Reggie Evans says:
Gil’s definition of a “pure point guard” must be: a guy who can’t score and passes a lot.
Mar.12 at 8:22 pm
Scott says:
Gil’s just trying to show that players shouldn’t be labeled by their position, and should be viewed for what they bring to the table as BASKETBALL PLAYERS. It doesn’t make sense for everyone to worry about who or what is a “pure” point guard, or comparing players to past players all the time - every new school point has their own unique style and it limits them to put labels on or draw too many comparisons.
Mar.12 at 8:29 pm
Dacre says:
I was wondering if it’s worth talking about the title “pure point guard”, What does that even mean…someone who NEVER looks to score?What IS a pg’s role? A player who’s role on the team INCLUDES setting up the offense, but surely he is PART OF THAT OFFENSE… you look at teams like the dynasty bulls where Scottie was a primary ball handler, A young Grant Hill - he set up the Detroits offense 10 years ago and the Jazz where the only difference between Stockton and Hornacek was the number on the jersey, initiating offense comes from various positions. This notion that only PG’s with big assist numbers are worth their weight has as much value as saying SG’s need to hit the three ball and centres need to be able to rebound…. …oh now I get it.
Mar.12 at 8:40 pm
nothin personal says:
k
Mar.12 at 8:48 pm
Reggie Evans says:
Gil should not be admiring Steph’s game. Steph’s the prime example of a dude with off-the-charts bball skills, but also someone preoccupied with either scoring or dishing out scoring passes, and nothing in between. Damn, I didn’t mean to sound vanilla, but there’s got to be something wrong with Steph’s game. If that isn’t it, what is it?
Mar.12 at 8:58 pm
nothin personal says:
In my opinion, the most pure version of a pure PG in the Nba right now (excluding JKidd since he is older than Mutombo and because it’s not fun to write about him since everybody knows that he is a pure PG), is Jose Calderon. I know Nash is great, but I am not convinced he can run a team in the halfcourt without scoring at least in half the posessions. (Btw, driving and dishing doesn’t make you a pg. It makes you a good passer. It’s important to be able to do it, because most offenses are based on that trade, but it’s not nearly enough). Deron definitely isn’t a pure point since he can’t keep his teams most important player happy (AK47), and the dude isn’t so hard to please either. He gets all those dimes by pick and rolling to death, but I think he gets a bit caught up into that mindset and forgets to play with the tempo to get the other team out of the game. Chris Paul probably is a pure pg, but as long as he doedn’thave an outside threat to play with, we can’t be sure that he won’t keep gunning for his 20 even if he doesn’t have to. Plus, I know he was just a rookie, but I wasn’t sold on him at the worlds.
Jose on the other hand, can score. In every possible way. He can drive, spot up, shoot off the drible, make circus shots, and even post up smaller guards. I’ve seen him take games over, score 15 in a 5-6 minutes and then not to shoot for the remaining evening. He is content to pass the ball, to run the offence focusing to exploit the weak spots for the defence and score only if nobody else is hot, or to open up the court for his teammates. Stockton like. That’s why he is such a hot commodity, and if Portland gets him, they might be instant contenders. You’ve been warned.
Mar.12 at 8:59 pm
Dacre says:
He’s what I term a “selfish passer”…for instance theres 4 seconds on the shot clock?…He’s giving it to a team mate so as to preserve his own FG%. He also needs to be the ‘PLAY’ maker. He wont initiate the offense unless it’s leading to his own assist numbers. You know how Stockton would make that first pass to hornacek? ( I refer to the 1990’s Jazz teams wayyy too much)… Marbury wouldnt make that 1st pass.
Mar.12 at 9:05 pm
nothin personal says:
P.s. The guys I mentioned are obviously great Pgs, and definitely way better players than Calderon. My arguement is that if I had a talent loaded, title contenting team, that needed litle scoring help, I would prefer Jose than any of the afforementioned three at the wheel (with the possible exception of Paul).
Or at the very least, i would prefer a Wade-Calderon Combo than a Nash-JRich one. (in ways of more off guard value with a solid, pure PG, than a better offensive threat at the 1 and a somewhat less tallented SG)
Mar.12 at 9:29 pm
Russ Bengtson says:
Here’s my definition of a true point guard, free of charge: a primary ballhandler who gets his team the best shot possible every time down the floor. That’s it.
Mar.12 at 9:47 pm
tealish says:
I don’t think you can tie AI in with Arenas like that. It’s actually extremely unfair. What options did AI have back in his heyday with the Sixers? He must have had the worst collection of second and third banannas that a HOF has ever had.
And yes, Deron is brilliant but don’t attribute Korver’s improvement solely on the way DWill runs the offense. How about having other threats such as Boozer, Okur, AK that make it easier for Korver to get open looks?
AI is a shoot first PG, a volume scorer and various other negative connotations regarding someone who plays his way at his position. But he’s damn good at it and it was the only way the Sixers could have made the Finals in 01. Note how his game is changing in Denver, but it is difficult to fully morphe your game after 10 years of averaging the 3rd highest scoring average in the history of the game.
Mar.12 at 9:51 pm
tealish says:
Nothin Personal, you are one crazy fool. I would take Nash over Calderon regardless of whoever was on the team.
If you were GM of the Suns, you are telling me you’ll make that Nash for Calderon trade? Even with the huge age differential, I wouldn’t. You’ll also get shot.
Mar.12 at 10:03 pm
riggs says:
no offense vince but i cant take an article serious that writes “thang” in it more than one time.
Mar.12 at 10:35 pm
stevie says:
Scott that is flat out stupid though. There are positions for a reason. you are supposed to play your position, the best team will have guys doing their jobs as their position requires. period. And a pointguards job is to run the offense, get people going, make the right play, be the most efficient guy on the court, and to WIN. That is the main thing. it is the quarterback……. …………………………………………………………………….. if you are a 7foot power forward that can shoot 3’s the coach is gonna say “Go down their adn get rebounds”, the guy says back “But I can hit this shot”, and the coach says “Yeah, but so can my guards and they cant rebound down there among all the bigs like you can, so your job is to rebound, let them shoot the 3’s”………… ……………………………………………………………………..
there is a POINT to having a position and playing it THE RIGHt way. That is the way to be successful, for reference watch a Boston Celtics game. KG is in the post on offense and is their pick/roll and pick/pop guy out to 18 feet on that, he scores in the lowpost when the double-team doesnt come and when they do trap down with a double he finds the open man for an easy score from inside/out cuz he’s a great passer, Rondo initiates and QB’s the offense plus controls the tempo and scores, Ray is the perimeter sniper 2guard that can also mid-range and take to the rim and can make plays with his passing, and Paul is the slasher/mid-range small forward that gets to the rim and also can perimeter burn you and makes plays with his passing, and Perkins grabs rebounds, set picks, garbage points, and defends/bangs down low anchoring the d with KG inside…….. all the bench guys do their jobs and everybody plays defense……………….. THOSE ARE THEIr POSITIONS and they play them TO a TEE, which is why they are 51-12. SAME CAN BE saId of tHe SPURS, THE PISTONS, ANY GREAT TEAM.
Mar.12 at 11:37 pm
Dacre says:
A topic like this can be a mute point if you consider that “ideally” you don’t want your point guard to be the best shooter / scorer on your team… THATS if your trying to be a “PURE” Guard. Hey Russ - Would you validate your (in my opinion: professional) opinion with an example? Who is/ Isn’t? What IF the best available option is for the PG do just keep shooting? (A big IF…A.I. you hearing?)
Mar.13 at 12:00 am
nothin personal says:
Got just a couple of beefs with that definition Russ. Would ypu prefer a couple of more shots made, or a happy shotblocker/rebounder? would you let a hot hand shoot all the time, while everybody else is getting ice cold? What about tempo? Making the other teams alpha dog work on defence, or get into foul trouble. Point guards are primarily court managers. Fisher like.
Mar.13 at 12:03 am
nothin personal says:
And AI has a big chunk of the respnsibility for not getting a decent supportive cast when younger. Remember, he never seemed to gel with anybody that came to help, mostly because he would never share the shots.
Mar.13 at 12:07 am
tealish says:
What legit superstars came in to help exactly? Don’t you dare say Larry Hughes.
Mar.13 at 12:09 am
hursty says:
Gil is ill.
Mar.13 at 12:11 am
nothin personal says:
and teelish, you can say that the suns were devised to play nash ball. Wich is probably why they can’t adjust to the playoffs and get in the finals. Plus, if you think that the Suns can’t get Calderon, Moon and Delfino, plus a couple of 1st rounders, you are crazy. I would have done something like that before trading for Shaq. On the other hand, I would have traded Dirk two years ago, If I was in Cubans place.
Mar.13 at 12:14 am
nothin personal says:
If you can’t incorporate Coleman, Keith van Horn, Thim Thomas, even if they are underachieving sobs,then you are not a pg. Plus, I heard that he had vetoed (or other players refused to play with him) more than a few trades.
Mar.13 at 12:46 am
d.Y. says:
not to be a stickler, but that’s spelled “moot” point Dacre. Good stuff Vince. It’s not that PGs can’t be the top scorer on their team if they’re the best at making baskets, it’s that they have the additional duty of running the offense and making sure the plays are executed properly. Gil’s comments are a bit saddening.
Mar.13 at 1:32 am
Dacre says:
Thats okay but I did mean a MUTE point…silent….like Duhons production right now. I want that kid starting for someone…I don’t know why the Hawks went after Bibby - Duhon has more to offer I feel. Would anyone agree that Terrell Brandon of those Cavaliers teams (when Mark Price got old) highlighted how a PG could ideally set up the offense for the team successfully and still lead them in points scored?
Mar.13 at 1:46 am
Sesa says:
Great piece and controversial as always Vince. I didn’t like Gilbert Arenas and his over-the-top self-promoting style but I do respect him as a ballplayer. The way his scoring style right now, Arenas should consider himself as a combo guard with leaning towards the Shooting Guards. Whether he run the offense or not, that’s a different story.
Mar.13 at 1:52 am
tealish says:
@ NP - I don’t know why you are throwing other players and draft picks into the mix when we are discussing which PG you would rather have running your team. If that trade was on the table, first rounders and everything, sure I’d take it. You get a younger PG in the process as well. But…again…I don’t see the relevancy. I was simply objecting to your outrageous statement that Calderon is more PG-material than Steve Freaking Nash. (I am not a Nash fan, by the way. I despised how he won back to back MVPs when you look at the company that puts him in.) But if you think the Suns will be better off with Calderon at the helm, I don’t know what else to say.
I’m not going to continue this ridiculous debate any longer. Here’s a peace offering: Go Raps…
Mar.13 at 4:40 am
Sesa says:
“The triangle isn’t a pick-and-roll offense, you just pass it to the post, spot up…”
Wow, I guess Gilbert is just built for scoring and passing when only someone double-teamed him…
Mar.13 at 5:43 am
Reggie Evans says:
Just read his whole blog entry … That stuff about Gil trying to copy Kobe’s afro was awesome … I don’t care what I said before, Gil is awesome, he’s just raging against the machine. He just reminds you that history isn’t mostly written by the participants, it’s written by, er, the writers.
Mar.13 at 6:55 am
nothin personal says:
I get your point, and I definitely agree that Nash is a better player. But is he a better PG? in the Suns system, yes he is. In a slower, more deliberate offense, I say he’s got holes in his game. My opinion is that Calderon is better at running an offense, if the team doesn’t need him to score. And as for the trade arguement, I guess my point was that in the league today you can amass a certain amount of talent. If you are good enough, you stop getting talent via draft. I would prefer my best talents (and salary capkillers) would be at SG and PF.
I am not a raps fan by the way.
Also, i agreed with the Mvp’s nash got. he was the key to the most succesfull system in the Nba, maximizing the potential of a team to agreat record. that’s mvp worthy in my opinion.
Mar.13 at 7:16 am
mat smith says:
gilbert is just not very intelligent, that all.
Mar.13 at 9:27 am
Tone says:
im wondering what eddie jordon and ernie grunfeld thought when they read it. ernie’s like, “this is the dude who wants a max. i sure hope elton brand doesnt sign with the clips.” eddie’s like, “makes sense to me, fadoopadoop.”
Mar.13 at 11:26 am
Boing Dynasty says:
“I think you can take somebody like Dwight Howard or Chris Bosh and you put them guys in those big cities and they’d blow up.” - Does he know Toronto is the 5th largest market in North America?
Mar.13 at 11:50 am
snyper48 says:
I think Gil’s misunderstood this time,maybe he didnt come out right but I know what he means.
Mar.13 at 12:27 pm
Vince says:
good comments, this time. I usually post a column and you guys go off on some tangent. Way to stay on subject with some insight.
Mar.13 at 3:06 pm
Myles Brown says:
I take everything Gil says with a pillar of salt.
Mar.13 at 3:12 pm
Vince says:
That’s a lot of salt, Myles.
Mar.13 at 4:15 pm
Sarah says:
“…he either seems to have no real grasp of what it means to be a point guard or he’s purposely diminishing the definition of a point guard to make his play look less inadequate.” - I’m thinking/hoping the latter of the two is true..
Mar.13 at 4:16 pm
Allenp says:
Sources say Iverson couldn’t get along with his teammates and vetoed trades. Nobody knows who these sources are, but Nothing Personal thinks their input is needed in a convo about Iverson. Lovely.
Mar.13 at 5:59 pm
nothin personal says:
Actually, it’s slam. i can’t remember exact issues, but it was implied more than once. Especially in noyz.
Mar.13 at 6:15 pm
MC TyG says:
A lot of reaction for that post so I’ll be quick.In that very long post, Vincent you’ve simply shown how much you didn’t get it.
Mar.13 at 7:20 pm
RoXaS says:
The point on Gilbert’s post was that he was a second draft pick just because he was a “combo guard”. And it’s obvious that in America de pure PG is gone: there aren’t no more Isiahs, magics,etc…now players have to be able to shoot AND pass. By the way, he has a blog in nba.com while you don’t. And he plays in the NBa, while you don’t.
Mar.13 at 7:39 pm
overtime says:
You’ve managed to sum up exactly whats wrong with Gilbert and why we all feel slightly guilty when we enjoy his antics. The wizards go nowhere with this current Gilbery.
Mar.14 at 10:37 am
Bubbachuck says:
i actually liked this article vince… xcept 4 tha 2 sentences about ai. who gives a f*ck about kyle korver?
Mar.15 at 8:30 pm
hursty says:
SHUT UP BUBBA! no-one likes ashton kutchers taller brother. (except you), no you are corract… ‘are we making sense yet!?’
Mar.15 at 8:30 pm
hursty says:
correct
Mar.16 at 10:46 am
thedude says:
Wow way to look too much into some trivial discussion Arenas was having about the semanctics of describing guards. I agree more with Gil’s musings than your overanalysis and tenuous jumps in logic to belittle the guy geez.
Mar.17 at 11:29 am
Bubba Chuck says:
y? ur a fag… wtf?
Mar.17 at 11:30 am
Bubba Chuck says:
so vince did u c tha game last nite?
Mar.17 at 11:31 am
Bubba Chuck says:
1
Mar.17 at 11:31 am
Bubba Chuck says:
6
Mar.17 at 11:32 am
Bubba Chuck says:
8
Mar.17 at 11:32 am
Bubba Chuck says:
8
Mar.17 at 11:32 am
Bubba Chuck says:
*168
Mar.17 at 6:53 pm
muggsy says:
how is it that point guards are required to be good at everything a point guard does in a game but power forwards (eg dirk) are allowed to stray to the perimeter and neglect their duties on the offensive glass.