Euro Backlash?
With The Draft a mere two days away, Dave D’Alessandro has a long and fascinating piece today about the draftability (sure, that’s a word!) of the species known as the European basketball player.
Basically, we learn that these days, it might no longer be so hot to draft a guy hailing from across the Atlantic Ocean.
“Gallinari is a pretty good player, and deserves to be a lottery pick,” one Eastern Conference executive said after requesting anonymity so as not to influence the draft. “But I would say this to anyone who drafts a European player that high: Understand that what you’re doing is counterintuitive.
“You are drafting a 19-year-old guy at a time when a top-10 pick implies instantaneous results, but you have to be very patient. It generally doesn’t always work out. Unless you are really lucky, it will take a big adjustment — to the speed of the game, the zone rules, the longer 3. And those adjustments typically take all the player’s spontaneity away for at least a while.”
The League execs who were interviewed for the article seem to be in agreement that the international market for ballplayers is in a down time.
But, what do you guys think? Should teams continue to aggressively scout players outside of North America? I mean, Chad Ford’s gotta keep busy somehow, right?
60 Responses to “Euro Backlash?”
Jun.24 at 12:03 pm
Gerard Himself says:
As a Nets fan I really like Dave D for the simple fact that he’s not biased. Yes, he writes about the Nets, but if they suck, he’ll write it. He’s very critical and honest, which is how it should be.
Jun.24 at 12:04 pm
the Birdman says:
Bryan Colangelo?
Jun.24 at 12:05 pm
Gerard Himself says:
and to anwer the question, yes, they should keep an eye out overseas. There’s plenty of talent around the world, but a lot of players are overrated, and GM’s should learn the word ‘patience’, when it comes to these guys. (I mean, the NBA can’t miss out on Ricky Rubio right?)
Jun.24 at 12:16 pm
Lz - Cphfinest3 says:
Basically if the player is good enough, he’ll be worth the investment. Might take a couple of years before his production is where you want it to be, but that’s the same with most American rookies. Really don’t think that adjustments to the rules and three-pointline are that big a deal. They can have trouble on D, because of the more contact allowed in FIBA and the pace of the American game/athletes. Being a long way from home (if the young guys are immature), and the language can be barriers, but then again that’s the same with American rookies + most of the world speak English to some degree. Right now the best talent is coming from the US, but the world is gaining by the minute. NBA teams would be stupid not to tab in to those resources imo.
Jun.24 at 12:21 pm
d_dub says:
that spaniard has a mad skillz.. total mad skillz!!!!!! that kid is only 17 and he is already playing the pro leagues.. during the FIBA Europe U16 Championship he drop 51 over russia and im not done yet 24 rebs and 12 dimes yeah 7 swipes as well.. best european player out there!!!! PERIOD
Jun.24 at 12:29 pm
B. Long says:
To say that they shouldn’t be aggressively scouting outside of America is an insult to the evolution of the game. Its not soccer(futbol’ to some), but over the past 25 years basketball has become an international sport. I’m just saying that I think the teams that have drafted Yao Ming, Tony Parker, AK47, Manu, Okur, Pau, Dirk, Peja, Jose Calderon, Hedo, Bogut and even Sasha will probably still keep an eye out for international talent.
Jun.24 at 12:36 pm
Mr. Bob Dobolina says:
“Unless you are really lucky, it will take a big adjustment — to the speed of the game, the zone rules, the longer 3. And those adjustments typically take all the player’s spontaneity away for at least a while.” Aren’t all those elements of the game new to American College players?
Jun.24 at 12:42 pm
Nick says:
Yes Dobilina. Yes they are. I think the key thing is that GM’s resist inflating a European players value because they are proud of finding him and take him to be somehow magical. Everybody has to adjust.
Jun.24 at 12:45 pm
Bubba Chuck says:
Ricky Rubio?
Jun.24 at 12:48 pm
Billymagnum says:
Let me break it down for everyone…euro players, (we don’t include manu in this argument, he’s from argentina), are SOFT!! period, end of story…with the exception of a couple of guards on the spurs, and Yao, there isn’t one really tough euro player out there who’s made an impact on a team large enough to have won a title…when talent is equal, heart almost always wins, and that’s the difference bet/ us and foreign players…that’s not to say that g.m.’s shouldn’t continue to scout and seek out the best available talent, but let’s be realistic, when leon powe can push pau gasol out from the basket and he’s only six eight, ’nuff said…euro big men would rather shoot jumpers than bang inside…and since when is fiba more physical than the nba…i can find you a pickup game in fifteen minutes w/more intensity than a fiba game…just because fools flop all the time, and refs understandably don’t call fouls, doesn’t mean the international game is physical, it really means they’re just soccer floppers on a hardwood court….
Jun.24 at 12:48 pm
Jukai says:
sometimes I find that the European players that are drafted high take a helluva lot longer to develop then those drafted much lower…
Jun.24 at 12:51 pm
Mr. Bob Dobolina says:
I’m with you, Nick. It seems to me like some of these risky picks come about because some scout wants his name up in lights for finding the kid. Anyone remember Nikolas Tskitishvili?
Jun.24 at 12:54 pm
riggs says:
b.long: change that “futbol to some” to “futbol to most” since i dont want you getting ransacked by angry euros.
Jun.24 at 1:01 pm
Pro says:
Billymagnum… Ronny Turiaf?
Jun.24 at 1:05 pm
Keith says:
“It generally doesn’t always work out” the ‘generally’ part of the sentence doesn’t sit well with me. I am a grammar nazi.
Jun.24 at 1:09 pm
Lz - Cphfinest3 says:
Billymagnum; Toni Kukoc was soft? Detlef Schrempf? Sabonis? Luol Deng? Mickael Pietrus? Biedriens? Tony Parker? On your physicality claim, we are talking Pro Ball here not streetball, so who cares what goes on in pick-up games. In Europe they don’t call all the small ticky-tack fouls you see in the NBA. There’s a lot more grabbing of shirts, handchecking, and pushing going on. That’s one of the reason (as well as the various zones used) the European players are not as good as the American in individual defense (AK47 being the exception), they are used to grabbing instead of using their feet. Wait and see at the Olympics, Paul, Bron, Kobe and co. will have a lot harder driving to the basket than in NBA play, hence every EURO being able to shoot. You should know that Tom T-something (can never remember his name) the guy who orchestrated the Celtics great defense designed this defense using a lot of European ploys.
Riggs; Futbol is Portuguese. Since the game was invented by England, you should change it to “Football”. Otherwise I’ll personally lead the angry lynch-mob of Euros. Hehe..
Jun.24 at 1:11 pm
Lz - Cphfinest3 says:
Adding to the list above: Sarunas M. (not even going to try to spell that name).
Jun.24 at 1:12 pm
Ryan Jones says:
I’m gonna start a Lower Merion backlash. Just for fun.
Jun.24 at 1:34 pm
Lz - Cphfinest3 says:
Billymagnum; btw Yao is from China, that’s Asia not Europe.
Jun.24 at 1:39 pm
Billymagnum says:
kukoc wasn’t soft? i’m calling shenanigans on that one…with the exception of detlef,and parker, those other cats are punks, talented, of course, but punks…remember, i’m speaking almost entirely about big men here, because most of the guards seem to have heart, but they aren’t the ones who get drafted early, big men are, and there’s a laundry list of “talented” big men from europe who can’t hack it…ask dirk, pau, and arvydis why they couldn’t pull it together when it counts, and you’ll understand…and to the ticky tack fouls they call in the nba versus europe,you’re supposed to call fouls, not ignore them, that’s the friggin rules…and your spelling on sarunas is this MARCIULONIS…AND HE WAS A BADA@@…BUT HE WAS ALSO A GUARD…not a big man…
Jun.24 at 1:40 pm
J says:
Celtics v. Lakers. Hmmmm?!?!! LA 5 euros, Boston zero. Celtics close it out by fiftty if they don’t pull the starters in the 4th. Heart has to count for something. They were closer to home in Boston then LA. Maybe they were thinking about hopping across the pond directly after halftime in Game 6.
Jun.24 at 1:47 pm
Ryan Jones says:
All white guys are soft, no matter where they’re born. And black guys jump higher. There are no exceptions. Haven’t we covered this topic sufficiently? Can we not now move on?
Jun.24 at 2:01 pm
Billymagnum says:
I personally have a fetish for beating dead horses and hey, only 97.98215 percent of white guys are soft…out
Jun.24 at 2:02 pm
Mo Charlo says:
Ryan has forgot about the Birdman. And possibly Rex Chapman.
Jun.24 at 2:04 pm
TADOne says:
Ryan with the ‘expert’ analysis.
Jun.24 at 2:12 pm
People's Princess says:
Drazen Petrovic’s rolling in his grave.Btw I’m thinking since Billy’s pretty liberal in his description of Euros to include players born outside good ole USA,why don’t you include Hakeem Olajuwon in that list??
Jun.24 at 2:32 pm
Billymagnum says:
@people’s-let me be more specific about my generalities…i was merely referencing european big men, no more, no less, specifically regarding their draft status….and please, i watched drazen play at golden state as a member of the nets, that dude was the realness…again, tho, he was a guard…and hakeem, dikembe, timmy, manu, and a host of other foreign players not from europe, are/were off the charts in ability and heart..
Jun.24 at 2:34 pm
TADOne says:
Drazen was before his time and was most definitely the truth.
Jun.24 at 2:47 pm
People's Princess says:
Accepted Billy.And yo Tad what’s good,my man???
Jun.24 at 2:48 pm
DDB says:
Billy Magnum….a lot of it depends on what coutries people are from. Some guys just come from a softer country or area. Other guys grow up kind of grimy in a real crazy country and they come out significantly tougher than anything we see in the NBA.
Jun.24 at 2:48 pm
TADOne says:
Not much PP. Check out our draft stuff when you get a chance.
Jun.24 at 2:56 pm
People's Princess says:
Just went through it Tad.Man Izzo’s da bomb.Check our draft stuff out as well Tad,when you got a minute.
Jun.24 at 2:58 pm
Jukai says:
Ryan doesn’t even want to debate anymore, just whine and occassionally say something humorous.
Jun.24 at 2:59 pm
Jukai says:
TAD, you don’t think a Durant/Mayo backcourt would be scary? I mean, if they somehow smack heads with each other in practice and learn the benefits fo sharing?
Jun.24 at 3:06 pm
TADOne says:
Jukai: I actually think Mayo would do well in almost any backcourt, because he is a versatile combo guard. But izzo actually wrote the piece, not me. PP: I’ve already been over there and read what you guys wrote. Really good stuff. I’ll pop back over and leave a comment.
Jun.24 at 3:19 pm
Jukai says:
Oh. I refuse to address Izzo directly. Ask him for me.
Jun.24 at 3:25 pm
iLL wiLL says:
Obviously, Bryan Colangelo and Dave D aren’t on each others friends lists.
Jun.24 at 3:31 pm
Russ Bengtson says:
Initially Euros were great because they made their bones playing against pros since birth and focused on learning the fundamentals. Guys like Drazen and Toni and Arvydas. But when you pluck them straight out of high school, you lose a lot of that. Skita and Darko were just like American high school kids, with the added pressure of being thousands of miles from home. Obviously it would be silly to give up on Europe entirely—there are successes like Tony and Andrei—but an 18-year-old Euro is gonna be much like an 18-year-old American. For good or bad.
Jun.24 at 4:09 pm
The Promise says:
I just with the people that are saying that Euros for the most part are soft. that doesnt always mean they arent good players(Dirk). But, Gallinari doesnt blow me away like Ricky Rubio does. He will be a hekuva NBA player. Not so sure about Gallinari. too raw.
Jun.24 at 4:10 pm
Silky Slim says:
Euro ballers are in a recession like the U.S. economy.
Jun.24 at 4:10 pm
The Promise says:
Im*****
Jun.24 at 4:12 pm
Earl "E.Sneed" Sneed says:
I think we have learned a lot about the Euros in recent drafts…there are very few Dirks, Ginobilis and Parkers…pick with caution!
Jun.24 at 4:28 pm
ciolkstar says:
Russ is spot on.
Jun.24 at 4:47 pm
Allenp says:
Mayo and Durant would be awesome. Mayo is the next generation Chauncey Billups. He’s a great defender, understands how to run a team, and can take over as a scorer. Plus, he’s way more athletic then the current version of chauncey and I think he’s taller. I’m an OJ fan.
Jun.24 at 5:01 pm
Jukai says:
It’s funny how I was always down on OJ, telling everyone how I was seeing Rose outdeveloping him, saying people were gonna see how flaws in college. Now I actually feel people are TOO down on him… he’s not the next Lebron, but I can see him as better defensive Gilbert Arenas. That’s all-star talent there.
Jun.24 at 5:06 pm
speedy says:
Hey Billymag your whole argument is weak .
Did you ever watch european pro ball except the guys playing in the NBA ????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????
Jun.24 at 5:31 pm
H to the izzo says:
Will the stoopid soft Euros please go home,you’re not wanted.Who do they think they are coming over here,taking our supermodels,playing a more fundamentally sound brand of basketball.CLOSE THE BORDERS!
Jun.24 at 5:58 pm
Emphasis says:
Izzo i’m with you, man. We (The U.S.) are in for a rude awakening come the Olympics (if Spain shows up ready to play).
Jun.24 at 6:00 pm
ciolkstar says:
If by “more fundamentally sound” you mean floating around the perimeter like a fairy, flopping constantly, and folding up in crunchtime…You would be completely right. Sweet shooting big men who average less than 10 boards a night are guaranteed to keep a ring off your finger in this league.
Jun.24 at 6:06 pm
ciolkstar says:
Dirk, Bargnani, Gasol, even Vlade Divac (who I loved as a player). Seriously though, to win it all you CANNOT have a soft spot at the 4/5 anymore (esp in the West: Melo, Amare, Dirk, Pau, Okur…ALL really hurt their teams with poor D) I know the Gasol and the Lakers made it past the Spurs this yearbut can anyone seriously defend Pau’s post season performance ?
Jun.24 at 6:11 pm
Emphasis says:
Pau’s performance in the playoffs wasn’t that good; especially in the Finals, he honestly just didn’t show up. However, international players are beginning to have an edge on American players. Americans really don’t even seem to have an advantage in athleticism anymore- look at someone like Borias Diaw or Andrei Kirilenko. This is why the U.S. needs to focus on more fundamental endeavors- such as shooting- to win in the international game. Michael Redd won’t get it done by himself in the Olympics. And international big men have the capability to strech defenses and open up the floor, unlike Dwight Howard and Carlos Boozer.
Jun.24 at 8:56 pm
Dacre says:
And they get to wear the same kind of shoes now too…
^_^
Jun.25 at 12:26 am
Jukai says:
Using Diaw and Kirilenko to prove a point usually isn’t very effective.
Jun.25 at 2:12 am
Slobodan Chutzpah says:
Billymagnum says: “With the exception of a couple of guards on the spurs, and Yao, there isn’t one really tough euro player out there who’s made an impact on a team large enough to have won a title.” Yes, since we all know that China is located in Europe.
Jun.25 at 4:46 am
Danny_W_UK says:
Amaechi is soft? I heard he was kinda hard………. Sorry had to add that. Luol is a euro, and he plays pretty tough. I gotta say though, watching the Finals as a Kings fan, I was screaming at the TV as Radmanovic and Gasol let people get open lay ups. I saw Ricky Rubio play in the UK last year, and his Basketball Brain is what seperates him, he sees the game so well. I think he was 15 years old at the time, playing pro ball on a mens team, and was head and shoulders above the other players. BUT!!!! in the NBA against strong men (guards and Bigs), Kobe, Ron Ron, Dwight etc he may well look soft. Bill Laimbeer…..Bill Laimbeer……Bill Laimbeer…….Bill Laimbeer………
Jun.26 at 3:24 am
Dacre says:
Jukai says:
Using Diaw and Kirilenko to prove a point usually isn’t very effective.
________________________________________________
Or to win games these days… :/ My favourite player for for near-on a decade was TONI KUKOC and I know he can’t play one on one Defense….The irony lies in the fact that he blocked alonzo twice the first time they ever played against each other (olymipics) and they were kukoc’s only blocks his whole career.. O_O
Jun.26 at 3:25 am
Dacre says:
I think you could go looking for european “blue-collar types” quite easily, but I can guarantee that they wouldnt be able to fill a plate at a sizzlers buffet let alone put the ball in the basket and at the end of the day that is all scouts LOOK at with european types.
Jun.26 at 3:27 am
Dacre says:
I think the officiating of the modern NBA game has a lot more to do with how successful foreign country players are coming into the league.
Jun.26 at 11:14 am
don thomas says:
where is slava medvidenko when u need him
Jun.26 at 11:22 am
L says:
billymagnum those so called soft european players have kicked your selfcentered and overconfident US players for the last two international competition..don’t you remember lituania at the olympics,greece at the worldchampionship..L